Schmigadoon!'s Cinco Paul, the creative mind behind Apple TV+'s Brigadoon!-inspired comedy series, spent just shy of 20 years dreaming up the show's musical world. Set somewhere between the 40s and 50s, with all the vibrant colors and choruses of a classic Hollywood musical, Schmigadoon! follows an on-the-rocks couple searching for their one true love. Soon, their quest magically transports them into a world where song and dance illuminate all the they don't understand about themselves, love and their partner.
Paul co-created and co-wrote the Apple TV+ series alongside his longtime creative partner Ken Daurio (Despicable Me). He also also served as showrunner and composed each delightful song of Schmigadoon!'s six-episode season. CBR had the opportunity to sit down with Paul for a retrospective of the series, where he broke down how his prior work in animation prepared him for the series, reflected on each episode's poignant moments and shared some behind-the-scenes insights into how the world of Schmigadoon! became as magical as it is.
CBR: You've done a ton of work within animation -- writing scripts, writing lyrics. What's something about that animation work that you think helped shape the world of Schmigadoon!?
Cinco Paul: Ken [Daurio] and I learned so much from the process of crafting an animated movie. It takes three years to make them. You're constantly rewriting them, almost daily throughout that process as the storyboards go up. You look at scenes, and you see what's working and what's not working. So, it's hard to pinpoint exactly, but I have to say that that process was really a crash course in storytelling -- in what works and doesn't work and creating characters that are interesting and compelling, and also a story that moves in the right way.
Speaking of that fluidity in the world of animation, was there anything about Schmigadoon! that changed from the scripts once you were on set?
As crazy as it sounds, things went pretty much as planned. There were a couple of minor rewrites that I had to do. One of them was the scene that we've rewritten a zillion times already in the writers' room. You know, I think everything I've ever done has had a scene that has a lot to accomplish, and so it's a really difficult one. But generally, it all went pretty smoothly. Nothing really caught us by surprise.
What was the scene that you kept rewriting?
It was actually the scene between Josh and Melissa where they go inside -- after they've been kicked out of the inn -- and they both have spent their flings. So, how do you resolve that and keep them moving together? Josh is concerned about the farmer who wants to kill him. [laughs] There was so much that that scene had to accomplish and was really important to get right. Actually, on the day of shooting it, Cecily and Keegan expressed some concerns and I said okay, "Let's let's talk through it." So we talked through it and ultimately got to a place that I think everybody was happy with, and I'm happy with how it works.
Speaking of Melissa and Josh, Schmigadoon!, obviously, is a play on Brigadoon!. And while Brigadoon! works really well, it's still an escapist kind of love story, whereas this series is all about Melissa and Josh facing the realities of love and how love can be hard sometimes. What was one thing, especially in the first episode, that you wanted to make sure got across about their relationship?
Yeah, it was really important to me that this was not a show about two people falling in love, but about two people who have fallen in love and are trying to make it work. There aren't a lot of romantic comedies that start in that place.
I think the really important thing is their first conflict with him losing her heart.
Yes! [laughs]
[laughs] And she's really upset. And he's like, "It's a rock." And she's like, "But, it was important to me." That's kind of the heart of their relationship. She's pushing him to work on the relationship, and he's like, "This is fine. We're fine." That scene is doing a lot of heavy lifting and was really important. I think it's an issue with so many relationships, right? That the couple doesn't have the same perception of what's wrong, or what the relationship is, which leads to a lot of misunderstandings and conflict.
Speaking of conflict, in Episode 2, we definitely see a lot of conflict between Melissa and Josh. Melissa puts on her cynical hat and pokes fun at Schmigadoon!. But I really appreciated how the "Enjoy the Ride" song brings us back to a place, so we don't get too cynical. Did you feel like "Enjoy the Ride" was meant to do that? To keep us feeling romanced by Schmigadoon!?
You hit the nail on the head. They'd just had their big fight, but Melissa would be so thrilled to have a song. That's something I always thought about and she loves it there and that little bit of joy she gets from joining in on "Corn Puddin." It's like, "Give her her own number. She's going to be over the moon!" We definitely wanted to explore how delightful that would be for her and how delightful for the audience to watch someone who's not a musical theater performer like Aaron Tveit. She's got a great voice and gets to join in on the fun.
Episode 2 also features a swan boat ride that was actually built for the production?! What was that process like in bringing that to life?
Yeah, it was amazing. That's the genius of Bo Welch, Schmigadoon!'s production designer. I think initially the pitch was for us to build a Ferris-Wheel.
Oh my god. [laughs]
[laughs] And they said, "We can't do that." Then I said, "Okay, what about a Tunnel of Love? That's actually better." That's the process of collaboration; it actually gets you someplace better. It was an actual functioning ride. There was water there and swans were on the track. We did have to speed it up. It wasn't all automated. We had some guys inside the tunnel pulling a rope that pulled them through, but it was a beautiful set. You walk in and you see that. It's just so exciting, because not only was it beautiful, but to me, it so evokes that feel of those old MGM musicals, especially when they go in the tunnel and those doors close. To me, it was a magical moment.
Yeah, it reminded me of when they'd have the black-and-white hearts at the end of the film with a painted stroke that wrote, "The End."
Yes! Exactly that.
In "Cross That Bridge," we see Josh try to take every lady of Schmigadoon! across that bridge. But after that huge, musical number, it ends with a very intimate scene between Melissa and Josh. Really, it's very much over between them. What was the hardest part about nailing that transition?
Yeah, it was tough writing that fight between them. It's the last straw for Melissa. I think there were earlier versions of that that were overwritten and had too much dialogue in there. Really, all you need to do is she's disgusted, and he's trying to justify that, in his mind, it was just an experiment. He's brash. He's being very rational. She doesn't see it that way at all. So I think, ultimately, we felt like the best way to do it was doing short and sweet.
He's left still trying to justify himself, but she's just done.
Yeah, I think the contrast really works.
Yeah! The contrast... This is this great line where Josh says, "I don't know how you define effort." That line calls back the huge musical number beforehand.
In Episode 3, Ann Harada as Florence Menlove singing, "He's a Queen One, That Man o' Mine." I loved that song so much. As someone who is queer, I did really appreciate that the series pokes fun at the gay character in a musical, but lovingly so, and this song shows that Florence is aware, in part, that her husband isn't fully embracing who he is. We see this play out in the series in a very sweet way, so I was curious how did you know when to end this song?
She and the Mayor deserve more than just a joke song. The best kinds of songs take the character on a journey. So if she's only singing about how naive she is, then it's kind of half of a song. It's half of what it's supposed to be. So that was really important to me that we've done our job right. Most of the jokes aren't a the expense of the mayor at all. It's just like, "Oh, oh, sweetheart." That's why Cecily's asides are so great.
But I really wanted the song to say that she loves him so much. Because she loves him, she knows that there's a part of him he's not revealing. She doesn't know exactly what that is, but I wanted her to ultimately be supportive of him because she loves him so much. Ann really embraced that and did an amazing job. She sang that song live. That's all her live singing. Amazing, incredible.
In "Suddenly," Melissa and Josh find their own romances in Schmigadoon!. Earlier in the month, I spoke with Jamie Camil about his role as Doc Lopez and he talked about how he saw his character as a mirror for all that Melissa can't see in herself. We talked about how both Melissa and Josh's romance teach them about themselves. What do you think that Melissa and Josh learn?
Well, Jaime's Doc Lopez is a classic trope from these Rodgers and Hammerstein musicals -- the sort of stubborn, patriarchal figure. It's the King in the King and I and it's the Captain in The Sound of Music, who are then changed by love. Someone stands up to them for the first time in their lives. So I think that's definitely how Melissa changes Doc Lopez.
I think her journey there is... She thinks she knows what she wants from romance. Then you give it to her, and then she realizes, "Oh, this isn't actually what I want. I want something a little more challenging. I want someone who just won't easily change, and say, 'Mold me into whatever you want to be.'" So it's kind of that fantasy fulfillment, where you get what you wish for and realize it's not all it's cracked up to be. There's something more and deeper, and maybe more complicated, but worthwhile than you want.
For Josh, it really was, he's a guy who needs to open up and get more in touch with his feelings. So we set him up with someone who's very similar to Melissa, in a lot of ways, but because it's not Melissa, it allows him to experience this in a different way. Really, the goal was for Emma and Carson to open him up. At first, he resists it. He's sort of [dating] her as a means to an end initially; but then, like that classic cliche, he ends up really falling for both... I'm interested in hearing what you think.
Yeah, I think I see how Doc Lopez mirrors Melissa's stubbornness. Like, in Episode 1, we see that she has about 5,000 books on how to fix a relationship on her nightstand, but it's clear she hasn't read a single one of these aloud to Josh.
[laughs] Yeah, I think there are parallels to Melissa's controlling nature in both Doc Lopez and Mildred Layton. Certainly, the scene when he's telling her, "I try to control everybody. I think I'm helping them but I'm not. I'm just making everybody miserable." When she says, "Well, there are good things about those qualities too." That's her recognizing herself in him, so that's exactly right.
"Tribulation" functions in this show as the big, musical number. Everything is building towards it and it's so great. It is also a 4-minute song! I was really curious about how you knew this song was gonna be the big number because it could have been any song. "How We Change" could have had a big musical number -- I like that it isn't, but I'm curious how you knew this number had to be the big one for the show.
Yeah!
I will have to say that that was [director] Barry Sonnenfeld and Christopher Gattelli, our choreographer, recognizing it. I think what did help make it even bigger than what it was on the page was making it one shot. Just having the steady cam following Kristin Chenoweth through that and Gattelli figuring out where everybody should be for each second during those four minutes. I will say that that song when we did its table read in the writers' room, it always killed because it's just a tour de force. It's so many words [laughs] and coming out so fast and the extra level of that was that that innovation, that idea to make it all one shot. Kristin was amazing. She's always up for a challenge and she nailed it.
Is there anything else that you really want audiences to know or take away -- aside from that it's a fantastic show that made even me love musicals?
[laughs] That's it. I wanted it to be joyful and delightful and for people to be surprised that it made them feel things at the very end. Those are my favorite things, whether they're movies or TV shows or on the stage that I'm laughing, laughing, laughing, and then suddenly, "Oh, my gosh, wait! I could cry." So that's really it for me -- It's a Wonderful Life, Groundhog Day -- it's those sort of movies that I was trying to emulate with the show. So, hopefully, we have to some degree.
Co-created by Cinco Paul and Ken Daurio,all six episodes of Schmigadoon! are streaming now on Apple TV+.