This is "From a Different Point of View," a feature where I discuss a comic book series with other people. This time around, due to everyone having to self-isolate, I figured I'd do a special edition where I discuss some crossovers with whichever readers that wanted to chat about them! We started off with Marvel's original Secret Wars and now we're doing Knightfall!

When last we checked in Knightfall, we had finished discussing Batman #496, Knightfall Chapter 9, "Die Laughing," by Doug Moench, Jim Aparo and Josef Rubinstein, colors by Adrienne Roy and letters by Richard Starkings. We talked about how the Joker and Scarecrow's plan to mess with Batman using fear gas backfired when Batman's fears manifested as Jason Todd being beaten to death by the Joker, which just drove Batman mad with rage and he knocked out the Scarecrow and began pummeling the Joker. When Scarecrow recovered as the Joker was being pummeled, the Scarecrow fired a bazooka at the underwater tunnel that they were in, forcing Batman to chose between capturing them or rescuing Mayor Krol, who Scarecrow and Joker had kidnapped. Batman had to go to save the innocent life, but as he got the mayor, the tunnel suddenly was hit with a rush of water, leading us into Detective Comics #663, Knightfall Chapter 10, "No Rest for the Wicked," by Chuck Dixon, Graham Nolan and Scott Hanna, with colors by Adrienne Roy and letters by John Costanza.

Sean Whitmore opened things up, "That is some cover. I’d have expected Ratcatcher to be in the issue, if I’d known who he was at the time." I replied, "Batman's like, 'Rats? Why'd it have to be rats?' This is the worst thing that will happen to me tonight by far!'" Flavio Sette also complimented the cover, "One of my earliest memories is seeing that cover (probably a couple years after the issue came out). Man, it's SO striking. It's simple; you don't have to know anything here, other than that Batman is the protagonist, and you get it. You get that things don't look good for Batman; even as a four year old, I got that. And then there's the gross out factor of having all those rats crawling all over him." Tom A. had a great question about the cover, "Are they even any rats in the issue itself?" I retorted, "Besides Mayor Krol? BURN, KROL! But no, Tom, you are correct, there actually aren't any rats in this issue. Which IS kind of bonkers, now that you mention it." Tom also noted, "Krol's pajamas changed from purple to pink. I guess it was the dirty sewer water." Flavio pointed out, "They're not even in the sewers! It's the Holland Tunnel, I mean, the, uh, Netherlands Tunnel, that's it!"

Sean noted, "I do like that, after 9 chapters of fist fights, Batman gets an old-fashioned death trap to navigate as part of his gauntlet." Flavio pointed, "Right off the bat (pun intended), we get one of the best opening splashes so far, IMO." I explained, "Chuck Dixon also gets a little Miller-esque in Batman's opening monologue. 'Maybe he'll laugh himself to death.'" Tom concurred, "Yeah, lots of monologuing." Sean added, "Yeah, Brian, I think this is the third issue in a row where Dixon has had Batman tell himself to stop complaining and get it done." I responded, "It really works. Especially for the set-up of the situation, which is that Batman is pushing himself beyond his normal levels.

Flavio wondered about Krol's portrayal in the issue, "Some of what Dixon does here seems like it's meant to redeem Krol, but, like, why even bother?" Tom A. agreed, "And Krol isn't really redeemed, he just likes Batman more." Sean noted, "It does make Batman seem pretty nice, giving Krol the benefit of the doubt like that. No, 'This guy’s a useless politician' or anything like that." Flavio went further, "Dixon does have Batman say Krol's a 'strong man'. So it really does seem like we're meant to just go 'oh, really, he's a good guy, he's just under a lot of stress.'" I pointed out, "I liked the way that they had Krol get super into Batman. It makes sense, as Krol has been so mealy-mouthed, but yes, it does make the 'strong man' line stand out, as that hasn't been established at ALL in the story so far." Flavio agreed, "Yeah, I mean, he was gonna call in the National Guard and declare martial law. Which is something that isn't at all controversial, or topical, nosiree. So yeah, boo, down with Krol. Marion Grange 1995!" Tom A. added, "Krol got too much into Batman since he was all in on Azrael and his brutal methods later." I responded, "Yeah, but that was the clever bit. That Krol got so hooked on Batman now, so that it made more sense why he would overlook Az-Bats later.

Tom questioned Batman's strategy of knocking Krol out, "I don't think knocking someone before submerging them is the best idea." Flavio added, "Yep, especially considering there's very little space near his head for oxygen. I think I've heard recently that people take deeper breaths when they're unconscious. So maybe sedate him, a little, but don't knock him out! Batman oughta carry some Xanax in that belt." I mentioned, "I'm torn on it. I assume Dixon is using SOME sort of real life evidence there. As that's a big jump otherwise. I do like the darkness of, 'If I fail, then he just never wakes up.'" Dang, Batman!" Sean replied, "It’s all really an effective sequence. Every panel is like, “I might die if I move forward but I’ll definitely die if I don’t.”

I noted, "It also seems like a throwback to the classic disaster film, The Poseidon Adventure, which I'm sure Chuck Dixon was a fan of, as I believe he also did a G.I Joe issue years later that reminded me a lot of the Poseidon Adventure, as well." There is a sequence where there is a dangerous swim through unknown waters to save someone's life (Shelly Winters got an Academy Award nomination for her heroic sacrificial swim here)...

Besides the Posiedon Adventure, I also thought Miller was a big influence in these pages, "'May lead to the riverbank. May lead nowhere.' That's peak Miller-esque dialogue, right?" Tom A. said, "To be peak Miller there needs to BE emphasis on random WORDS. Flavio argued, "Honestly, it could pass for something Claremont might write. He loves doing that kinda thing, especially if he's dropping pronouns and making juxtapositions. 'Could be hell, or better yet, could be heaven.'" I replied, "Good point, Flavio. That might be how Miller developed. He took the Claremont style and then added his own DISTINCT flair." Sean added, "That’s before Miller devolved into self parody and started repeating everything. Repeating everything. Saying everything two or three times."

Batman got Krol to safety without either of them drowning. But next, he has to face off against Bane's three minions! That'll be next time!

If anyone has any thoughts or questions about Knightfall, feel free to drop me a line at brianc@cbr.com, maybe I'll even address your comment/question in a future column!