This is "From a Different Point of View," a feature where I discuss a comic book series with another writer. In this case, it is CBR's own Eileen Gonzalez: who will be going over the history of the Avengers with me, story by story!

We continue with

Avengers #11 "The Mighty Avengers Meet Spider-Man," by Stan Lee, Don Heck and Chic Stone

Brian Cronin: Interestingly, even Heck is now being inked by different people. I sort of figured that Heck/Ayers would be a real team, but I guess not.

Eileen Gonzalez: Yeah, the inkers and letterers really seem to come and go on this book.

Brian Cronin: Is that another letterer shot on the splash page?

Brian Cronin: Lachrymose means given to weeping

Brian Cronin: But that COULD mean that it is so good that it makes people weep!

Eileen Gonzalez: Ha, maybe! Or that the fate of the robot is just that sad.

Eileen Gonzalez: (Uh, spoilers, I guess)

Brian Cronin: Ha! You've ruined the whole comic book!

Brian Cronin: Why even keep talking now?

Brian Cronin: I love that the blurb is just "Wowee." That's awesome.

Eileen Gonzalez: It should also say "liar" because neither the cover nor the splash page comes anywhere close to happening in the actual issue!

Eileen Gonzalez: And the Wasp remaining free while everyone else gets captured? Is this Opposite Day?

Brian Cronin: Ha!

Brian Cronin: Speaking of "Wowee," the issue opens with an awesome piece of bureaucratic nonsense! Wowee!

Brian Cronin: First, Thor is just a total dick to Giant-Man when he calls him in for a meeting.

Brian Cronin: Giant-Man's experiment looks pretty lame anyways, as it just seems to burn through his counter.

Eileen Gonzalez: That rule seems super impractical though. If they're in the middle of fighting another supervillain, do they have to abandon the fight to come hang out with the Avengers?

Eileen Gonzalez: "Oops, sorry, Mr. Bank Manager, I can't stop this robbery after all, the Avengers await!"

Eileen Gonzalez: Poor Hank just wants to do science but superheroing keeps getting in the way

Brian Cronin: That's why Cap's suggestion is such a dumb one.

Brian Cronin: "In honor of Tony Stark's apparent death, let's suspend all operations."

Brian Cronin: "Avengers! Help! The Masters of Evil are spraying adhesive all over the city! It's really not threatening, but it's mildly annoying!" "Sorry, citizens, we're on break."

Eileen Gonzalez: Clearly all supervillains would cease all activity for 24 hours to honor the death of a weapons manufacturer. That's how that works.

Eileen Gonzalez: Giant Man's the only one with a brain here

Brian Cronin: Luckily, Giant-Man quickly checks Cap's dumb plan but then Rick tests Cap's wrath by trying to get involved

Brian Cronin: "YOU DON'T HAVE VOTING PRIVILEGES, RICK!"

Brian Cronin: "I WILL DESTROY YOU!"

Brian Cronin: "YOU'RE NOT BUCKY!"

Eileen Gonzalez: Ha! I especially love how Rick just seems to pop up out of nowhere. There's no hint he's even at this meeting until he speaks and then he's suddenly at the table.

Eileen Gonzalez: I bet BUCKY would have known to keep his mouth shut until spoken to.

Brian Cronin: BUCKY!!!!

Page 2: [valnet-url-page page=2 paginated=0 text='The perils of time travel!']

Brian Cronin: Wasp has a new costume. I sort of dig it. It's weird, but I like the W on her forehead.

Eileen Gonzalez: It's definitely eyecatching!

Brian Cronin: She was all, "Hey, if Cap can have an A on HIS forehead, why not me, too?"

Eileen Gonzalez: New plan: all the Avengers have to have the first letter of their name on their foreheads.

Brian Cronin: Giant-Man's a bit of a weirdo to the Wasp when she puts on some makeup when the meeting is over. It's seriously not a big deal to put on some lipstick, dude.

Eileen Gonzalez: I guess when you're the only person wearing lipstick in the room, you stand out more. But yeah, that's was weird.

Eileen Gonzalez: "None of us GUYS are stopping to put lipstick on, Jan, what's YOUR problem?"

Brian Cronin: They're so dysfunctional.

Eileen Gonzalez: You'd think that would make them easy to beat, but somehow, no.

Brian Cronin: By the way, with Iron Man missing, why haven't we gotten any lines about how they are now "broken up"?

Eileen Gonzalez: They're too busy staring at Jan's lipstick.

Brian Cronin: Kang's plan (one-upping the Masters of Evil's plan of attacking the Avengers with another hero by using a robot of another hero because it won't break from the plan like Wonder Man did) is so hilariously nonsensical.

Brian Cronin: "I must create someone who I can control completely, so I will make a robot!"

Brian Cronin: "But I can't make robots of their villains, because they might fight with each other!"

Brian Cronin: "Even though I just explained that the benefit of using a robot is that they do whatever you tell them to do"

Eileen Gonzalez: I'm so disappointed in Kang's plan. Here's this emperor/dictator with a thousand-year advantage over us, and his grand scheme is basically the same plot that failed to work for the Masters of Evil AND the Space Phantom? For shame, Kang, for shame.

Eileen Gonzalez: Maybe if he stopped creeping on Spider-Man, he'd have time to come up with a better plan.

Brian Cronin: "I must now list all of his amazing powers." Huh?

Brian Cronin: Although, Kang carefully picked up on Cap's hint from last issue, where he fears no man that lives or breathes, so that means Cap is scared shitless of robots.

Eileen Gonzalez: Very true. One point to Kang!

Brian Cronin: "Spider-Man? Pshaw! Wait, he's a Spider-Man ROBOT??! Oh man, oh man, oh man"

Brian Cronin: Also, not for nothing, copying the Wonder Man plan wasn't such a bad idea, as the guy almost DID kill all of the Avengers before he had his change of heart. So I can't knock Kang too much for his plan. Except for the whole, "I am from the future but I can only look back towards stuff that happened right around the time where I last saw the Avengers for...reasons"

Brian Cronin: I'm surprised that someone like Mark Gruenwald didn't come up with an explanation for why Kang couldn't see his future fights with the Avengers in the future.

Eileen Gonzalez: Not to get too paradox-y, but shouldn't Kang already know whether or not his Spider-plan works or not? Since it happened in the past and all?

Brian Cronin: Yeah, there that has to be some sort of time travel secret that limits him to viewing stuff only from before the point where he affects the time himself, right?

Brian Cronin: That's the only thing that makes any sense. I guess it's like the Doctor Who "timey wimey" deal, as it really never makes sense in the end.

Eileen Gonzalez: Kang is clearly way smarter than us, I'm SURE he knows what he's doing.

Brian Cronin: I dig how they used three separate panels just to say "I built a Spider-Man robot who is a duplicate of Spider-Man"

Brian Cronin: As if we were going to call bullshit if they didn't throw in the extra two panels

Eileen Gonzalez: Kang put a lot of effort into this and he wanted to show his work.

Brian Cronin: "Wait, is this accurate to the the sub-microsopic detail?"

Brian Cronin: "If not, I call bullshit."

Brian Cronin: "Oh, so it is. Okay, carry on, Kang. You've satisfied any concerns I had."

Eileen Gonzalez: Kang believes in making his scientific research public.

Brian Cronin: I like how hoodlums just attack Cap out of nowhere. That was a very well thought out fight scene.

Brian Cronin: "You know, hoodlums just attacked Cap. Just go with it!"

Eileen Gonzalez: Considering he's right outside Teen Brigade HQ, I'm surprised they didn't all run out to help him.

Eileen Gonzalez: Maybe Rick is still sour about the meeting.

Brian Cronin: I'm sad that we missed out on wide brim hat guy

Eileen Gonzalez: If only Cap had taken a little longer to defeat those crooks, I'm sure he'd have been right there.

Eileen Gonzalez: But we get Spider-bot instead.

Page 3: [valnet-url-page page=3 paginated=0 text='The Avengers have learned SOME lessons, at least']

Brian Cronin: It's good to know that they've moved on from their Wonder Man position to "Wait, we have to actually check you out before just adding you to the team."

Eileen Gonzalez: Ha, yeah, shockingly they learned something.

Brian Cronin: Which does beg the question, "If you're a time traveler, why not send the robot to BEFORE the Wonder Man caper?"

Brian Cronin: I'm sure Mark Gruenwald had an explanation for that, as well, during his time at Marvel.

Eileen Gonzalez: Heck, why not send a robot to kill all the Avengers individually before they get superpowers?

Brian Cronin: Well, that wouldn't be sporting. Kang's a jerk, not a sociopath.

Brian Cronin: The debut of the Wasp-Instinct!

Brian Cronin: It's too bad that didn't become a thing

Brian Cronin: "My Wasp-Instinct is tingling!"

Eileen Gonzalez: I guess they had to pick between her sting or her instinct or else she'd be just TOO powerful.

Brian Cronin: She DID almost kill the X-Men later in Secret Wars with her increased sting ability, so yeah, that would be too much.

Eileen Gonzalez: Meanwhile, you'd think the Spider-bot would be programmed to lead with the bit about Iron Man being in trouble.

Brian Cronin: Well, I guess Kang wanted to test just HOW dumb the Avengers were.

Eileen Gonzalez: I assume he is pleased with the results.

Brian Cronin: "First, see if they'll just put you on the team without any questions asked. If not, then go to phase two."

Brian Cronin: I love that the robot has his own thoughts and they're about how pleased he is that Kang thought to give him spider-man's vernacular!

Eileen Gonzalez: So since the bot can't do anything Kang doesn't tell him to, does that mean Kang specifically programmed Spider-bot to think nice thoughts about him?

Brian Cronin: Ooooh...deep

Brian Cronin: Sounds like the sort of thing Kang would do

Brian Cronin: We get to meet the Avengers alternate battle cry, "Avengers...Away!"

Brian Cronin: It doesn't have quite the same ring as "Avengers Assemble!", does it?

Eileen Gonzalez: Presumably Superman showed up and had words with them about that one.

Eileen Gonzalez: And you gotta love how Ant-Man and Wasp have to fly commercial to get to Mexico. So much for the Avengers helicopter!

Brian Cronin: Luckily it was heading the right direction!

Brian Cronin: It would be awkward if they had to hijack a plane to get to the right spot!

Eileen Gonzalez: Or if the plane had to make an emergency landing in the middle of Alabama or something.

Brian Cronin: Now Giant-Man has "Cybernetic Sense." You have to love the powers that come out of nowhere.

Eileen Gonzalez: Wasp Instinct, Cybernetic Sense... whatever will be next?

Brian Cronin: The good thing about him having cybernetic sense is that it makes his creation of Ultron make a bit more, well, sense.

Brian Cronin: As he clearly wasn't just a biologist

Eileen Gonzalez: Yeah, true. He's pretty much an all-purpose scientist at this point.

Eileen Gonzalez: Wasp actually does something in this fight scene!

Brian Cronin: Yeah! She was just waiting this whole time for someone to work out a maneuver with her!

Brian Cronin: "I'm ready to fight, but I've had no maneuvers taught to me yet, so I'm useless!"

Eileen Gonzalez: She works better that way, it seems!

Brian Cronin: I'd like to believe that she did, in fact, want them to kill Spider-Man and make stew out of him.

Brian Cronin: "I don't know why everyone assumed that was a joking reference and not a literal one."

Eileen Gonzalez: Ha! She had extra motivation to kick his butt.

Eileen Gonzalez: She forgot lunch and is hangry.

Eileen Gonzalez: It's so weird that Thor tells Spider-bot he doesn't "need to battle a girl." That "girl" is an Avenger??? That's her job???

Brian Cronin: Well, she's SORT of an Avenger. Like Rick.

Brian Cronin: "She doesn't have punching privileges!!!"

Eileen Gonzalez: She's been upgraded to stinging privileges, at least.

Eileen Gonzalez: That's more than Rick gets.

Brian Cronin: "Perhaps I can taunt him into defeat!"

Brian Cronin: Kang needs to put more thought into these things. Who does he think he is, Don Rickles?

Eileen Gonzalez: I think this fight only lasted as long as it did because the Avengers still haven't learned to fight all together. They just show up one by one and get defeated the same way.

Brian Cronin: "We were broken up again!"

Eileen Gonzalez: "This is Iron Man's fault! We wouldn't be broken up if he was here!"

Page 4: [valnet-url-page page=4 paginated=0 text='Is Kang the secret hero of the Avengers?']

Brian Cronin: How did Cap get there? He's just parachuting from a random plane?

Eileen Gonzalez: He taught the Teen Brigade to fly airplanes? I got nothing.

Brian Cronin: I liked Cap talking through the Spider-Man attack.

Brian Cronin: "What are you doing? You're pushing that stone on me. You shouldn't be doing that!"

Eileen Gonzalez: Melodramatically talking about a fight is how they did things back in World War II, I guess.

Brian Cronin: So wait, was the real Spider-Man the pair of "Cold, angry eyes" from before?

Brian Cronin: And if so, huh?

Eileen Gonzalez: I did assume that was him.

Brian Cronin: "Cold, angry eyes," though?

Eileen Gonzalez: I mean, if someone was impersonating me and using my name to murder the Avengers, I wouldn't be thrilled either. Mostly I'm just wondering how Spidey got down here. Did he cling to the underside of the same plane that brought Ant-Man and Wasp?

Brian Cronin: Or the Teen Brigade plane that took Cap? That I am assuming was piloted by wide brim hat guy!

Eileen Gonzalez: Plot twist: Peter Parker is a member of the Teen Brigade.

Brian Cronin: OH MAN! THAT'D BE AWESOME!

Brian Cronin: The whole battle between Spidey and the fake Spidey hilariously comes down to Spider-Man pressing the "off" button on the bad guy's back!

Eileen Gonzalez: At least they fought in midair! That was kind of exciting!

Brian Cronin: And then Spider-Man just...floats away? Huh?

Brian Cronin: He just builds a big webbing parachute and floated away. That's pretty badass, honestly.

Eileen Gonzalez: That web fluid is real versatile stuff.

Brian Cronin: It somehow didn't keep Don Blake from reaching his hammer, though!

Brian Cronin: Which, of course, should have transformed back into Don Blake's walking stick, right?

Eileen Gonzalez: Yeah, I've noticed they are a bit inconsistent with that. I don't think it turned into the walking stick in the Wonder Man issue when Thor was stuck under a boulder, either.

Brian Cronin: I love the Avengers claiming that they won't be caught unawares again

Brian Cronin: They weren't technically caught unawares this time, either

Brian Cronin: They went in with their eyes open

Brian Cronin: They're just way too gullible in general.

Eileen Gonzalez: "From now on, no more secret criminals will join the Avengers! I can state that with absolute certainty!

Brian Cronin: Kang then gets the dejected walk away bit that was typically reserved for the end of sad sack Spider-Man stories!

Eileen Gonzalez: Yeah, that's a pretty funny touch.

Eileen Gonzalez: Are we supposed to feel bad for him?

Brian Cronin: "Awwww...the Avengers weren't killed! I feel so bad for him!"

Brian Cronin: "Couldn't they have let at least one of them die so he could get a partial win?"

Eileen Gonzalez: Incidentally, I don't think we see the Avengers ever actually thank Spider-Man for saving them. That's just rude.

Brian Cronin: They're still mad that he framed Simon Williams for embezzlement.

Brian Cronin: The Avengers are all dedicated readers of the Daily Bugle.

Brian Cronin: So they all inherently hate Spidey.

Eileen Gonzalez: Ha!

Eileen Gonzalez: Everyone hates Spidey.

Eileen Gonzalez: That seems about right.

Brian Cronin: Kang gets a pin-up in this issue.

Brian Cronin: So maybe we ARE supposed to like him kind of.

Brian Cronin: It's him looking at images of Rama-Tut and Doom on video screens, while Kang is all angry-looking

Eileen Gonzalez: Kang is staging a slow takeover of this book.

Brian Cronin: Sort of like, "Argh, how can I not be more successful than these two bozos!"

Eileen Gonzalez: He looks like he wasn't planning on getting his picture taken, like someone just snuck into his room and took the photo.

Brian Cronin: The entirety of the Avengers run so far was just a publicity stunt for a Kang solo book.

Eileen Gonzalez: Oh, those crazy, crazy publicity stunts.

Brian Cronin: The citizens of the Marvel Universe were right to be wary this whole time!

Eileen Gonzalez: Marvel's advertisers deserve their own comic.